Wednesday, 29 July 2015

What a 30k / 40k fan wants they get. Redux.

What a Warhammer 40k / 30k gamer wants? They get? Part 2 / Redux. 

Hi all out there. This is a follow on with the wish listing the community at large are wanting and my opinion of if we will get it from papa GW. 

GW have gotten lots and lots of stick in the past, ghastly models childish looking kits and them moving away from the Grim-Dark image of 40k most recently. They also got a lot of stick for price hiking, tearing down their Social media sites, not listening to fans etc etc. GW still make some mistakes (in my opinion Logan's sled, turning the Space Wolves Blue, Space Wolves on Wolves (FW will not be doing this thank god), the weird flying Land Speeder sermon machine of the Dark Angels, the Khorne Tonka train (thankfully retconned by FW) and Centurions) but their quality and design has got markedly better. The models look more dynamic than before and they appear to be listening to the fans more. 

I am still concerned with the amount of Computer games being released (it seems almost daily at the moment), I just hope they don't dilute the hobby too much. 

So the Question is: Are they being too good to us? Maybe the horrible monster has now become the good guy? It was Big Foot now it is Harry from Harry and the Hendersons?

Let's see. Please comment at the bottom too. 

We wanted Chaos Cultists: We waited years and years, and finally we got them. Our Narrative battles are better and more detailed than ever, and with another box of the models rumoured with multiposable Cultists in the next year or so: Great. 

We wanted Primarchs and the Horus Heresy: We got them! Forge World have done such an amazing job for the last 3 years with the Hobby, breathing a breath of fresh air onto our table tops. 

We asked for Knights: Got them. Two lovely choices from GW. In my last post on this subject I stated that I wanted a fist for my Errant, got it now with 3 more options :) we also have five variants from Forge World. I would love to see GW do another Combi box of Crusader/Castellan instead of Forge World (and on a different chassis) who can tackle the Warden etc. adding the 3 different / variants and riding over existing fluff did upset me a bit. 

We asked for Skitarii: they have arrived. We weren't sure if these choices were around in 30k, and thankfully they answered this with the Cybernetica cover :) As FW did with the Knights, I can envision a good few sets of weapon / head swaps at least for their versions. 

We asked for Adeptus Mechanicus: we got it, and hopefully GW realise how much money they can make listening to the community who have been asking for it for years. 

Now attention. My thoughts why GW released the Skitarii seperately from the Adeptus Mechanicus Codex are; Skitarii were around in 30k but Adeptus Mechanicus was not (Mechanicum became Adeptus Mechanicus). Maybe this format will help GW release small mini-dex that are available or not available in the rumoured age of Darkness expansion. Could we see mini-dex of other armies which are fully 30k-able? The Astra Militarum were not around, but Storm troopers (as mentioned in places inc Mark of Calth) were, now I know the Storm troopers will vary in design through time and across the Galaxy, but this set May be GW's plan. 

We wanted a Warlord Titan: we got the flipping thing (as did I). Thankfully they are fully supporting the options for this kit too with additional heads weapons etc. score another one for GW/FW. 

We wanted plastic Horus Heresy core options: We are getting this now, with MKIV seen already and a whole range rumoured including Cataphractii and Contemptor, this is fantastic news for anyone who likes 30k but can't afford it. I do believe FW creating the Deredeo was them future proofing themselves against losing the Contemptor to plastic and I think the same with the Sokar . . .

We want Plastic Thunderhawk: I think this is getting closer. FW have just made a Sokar Stormbird (which is almost the exact size of the Thunderhawk) and I really don't think there is room for both, especially as the the Lucius Warhound has been retired. With the Sokar and Thunderhawk Landing pad approaching, I can see the Thunderhawk getting shifted to plastic in a year. 


We want Plastic Warhound Titan: With the Lucius being possibly discontinued, could it be a good time to see this Chassis be re wrought in Plastic? With FW also talking about doing lesser Titan Chassis it could be a possibility. The Lucius armoured back / shoulders are not bigger than the Shrine of the Aquila, so a £170-£200 is not unfeasible. 

We want Squats back: This will happen. I don't care what anyone says now, we are getting Squats back (possibly as Demiurg). This is based on the fact the Skitarii and Adeptus Mechanicus mini ranges doing so well. Now this could also be another mini-Dex like the aforementioned Harlequins, Adeptus Mechanicus and Skitarii? It could be. That way a base plastic force of them could be used in 30k as a force and also in 40k as a lesser race. We know they have written the Squats back in after a comment like "The Squat home worlds are thriving" in the last edition Rulebook. Forge World could easily pad them out in Campaigns to suit. 

We want More Xenos: Humanity may own the stars in 30 and 40k but we really need some more races to fight!

We want Mini-Dex Genestealer Cult: Rumoured to be on its way :)

We want Mini-Dex Tarellians: This is a species that was very prevalent in 30k throughout the Galaxy, and the Tarellian Dog Soldier imagery has been in many a Rulebook now. The great thing about this race is: they are still round in 40k as a Tau ally / Mercenary force (go mini-Dex!). If this Age of Darkness expansion arrives then a force / army like this will be extremely successful (especially as the Lizardmen in Fantasy have taken to the stars now - maybe it is a prelude?). All we would need is a Troop multi-pack, a few elite multi-packs and a few vehicle multi-packs and we are away!! The packs could come with basic options and Tau allied options. Go on Games Workshop!! Then FW could go mad with additional upgrades and options (back to its roots again). 

We want Mini-Dex Hrud: Same reasons as above really. In 40k and 30k, spread across the galaxy, very few choices required to make them a force and another army is born. I personally would merge both Hrud designs into one army (bendys and rat guys). 

We want plastic Sisters of Battle: It's going to happen, it has too. 

We want Rogue Traders: We know it is being planned, we have seen it in book 2 Massacre with notifications regarding a Rogue Trader list. Awesome. Bring these Characters in. 

We want Custodes: With the recent End times from GW, it could be that GW is going to plan a story shift for 40k soon. I fully believe this is going to happen. Now if this is the case, GW might be releasing a plastic Custodes range for the inevitable war on Terra, which could be another reason why FW postponed Inferno (now called Retaliation I think)? We know they were told they were not allowed to do Knights as GW were planning on them in plastics. 

I for one am happier with the Company than ever before (RTB01 era I first started) and just hope they continue the way they are. Just no more terrible looking childish kits please. 

Drake Seta


  1. Us Brits hate change so I'm still holding my breath to see what happens. I've been collecting since rogue trader too so have invested a lot of my time, money and emotion into this hobby over the years. The HH series, both from black library and FW have been like a dream come true, and the quality from FW is amazing. I'm just hoping GW prime don't water down that quality. I guess I just have mixed feelings about having spent a shed load on resin only to hear that GW are now making the same thing in plastic. I don't want to sound negative though, if I was one of those that seem to hate GW all the time I wouldn't still be in the hobby after all these years!

  2. I don't want 40k to get an AoS treatment. That would drive me out of the hobby altogether.

    What I do want, however:

    - More Xenos, however minor they may be. Even a small White Dwarf list, a couple of formations and two combo-boxes will suffice as an allied force. Especially Hrud, I like their bendy design a lot more than the rat look.

    - Squats. They were cool and I wasn't even around for them. Probably not going to happen but it's fun to dream.

    - Another Ork update. I know they were the first book of 7th edition, but quite frankly, they have aged extraordinarily after Eldar, Necron and even Space Marines hit. Though that might be because I play in a largely Necron meta, I find Orks real lackluster in comparison to newer releases.

    - Mechanicum/Cult Mechanicus/Skitarii cross compatibility, or at least the ability to ally at the Battle Brother/Allies of Convenience level. I only started my Mechanicum force because there was no real way to represent a Mechanicus force until recently.

    And one nitpick. Demiurg aren't Squats! Any self respecting space dwarf would probably take insult in being confused for a filthy Xeno!

  3. I agree with you, they really do seem to be listening in terms of which models we want to see, and continue to up their game year on year in terms of the standard of their range! They do seem to have recognised a few of the mistakes they made recently (logan, ect.) and are moving back to a more grimdark image. FW as always is leading the way here. The models are GREAT and there is very little to fault. They will likely deliver on your wishlist, which will be awesome as some of those things sound fantastic.

    However, as you mentioned earlier, the problem lies in how they interact with the community. They have no online presence, making big decisions with zero community input (see AOS) and dropping them with little warning (see how much we rely on leaks). They constantly mess with trade agreements with local providers to ensure that their own stores can do better, resulting in many closures (see miniwargaming). But then downsize those very same stores to one man with ridiculous sales targets, effectively making them a sales shop with product pushing manager as opposed to a centre for hobby activity. They ignore competitive gaming completely. They have put us through price rise after price rise and try their hardest to force us into paying double for limited editions (black library are particularly bad at this). They purposely hold stuff back that should be standard to drain yet more money (for example dataslates or formations that should really be in the codex in the first place). Not to mention they still face a huge number of balancing issues in the rules..

    I love this hobby, and think the miniatures are easily the best in the world. However, there remains plenty of work to be done to bring this company back to it's world conquering best. I hope that they can see that too.

    1. The last year has seen some massive releases and yet their sales are still down. I personally dont think they are listening lol

  4. Squats are already back! Sort of! Check the fluff corebook, in the section on abhumans. They're listed as a surviving strain of abhuman.

    So the Tyranids didn't get them all!

  5. Speaking of community interaction and online presence, there's a golden daemon event this weekend and next to no hype about it. The only reason I'm going is because a friend and I booked a gaming table and then discovered the event was also on at the same time!

    1. Lol. I have been informed there may not even be a Warhammer-Fest this year (hence the broken down / segmented Golden Daemon).
      It is sometimes as if one of these Corporate"Lean" chaps have come in to trim the fat, but sometimes the fat is the best bit!

    2. GW need an event like Games Day every year to get the hype up. The fans love it. Three Golden Daemon events that slip under the radar will do them no favours really. FW have just emailed about upcoming events in September... that's how much they care about this weekend! lol

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  7. I feel as though I shouldn't really comment as I dont support GW really. I have only bought 2 GW products in the last year and as such I am part of the problem this company faces. The company is suffering from an identity crisis (although this seems to have been cleared up - they are a model company) and has no reasonable market research. Do they listen to the fans? No, I dont actually think they do. All my money goes to the far better and more approachable staff at FW - they actually tell us an overview of the next 6 months showing WIPs and sneak peaks. Why cant GW do that?

    It looks as though GW is having a proper look and rethink at the way they intend to go in the future and that needs to be positive. If they were intelligent they would look outside the box a bit maybe. Simple way to get new customers? Create a tv series? Look at the massive boost the company got when it created the Lotr range (best game they have made alongside Necromunda)! Now picture them getting paid for the rights to make a series and then profiting from the increased interest in their OWN IP. I know its not quite as simple as that but what an idea eh?

    I think the rules simplification will be a good thing for 40k too. I feel as though I want to support GW but I have no trust in the direction they are taking their games. I can see 7th edition being the last edition I stick with. 12 years ago was the last time I took a break from this hobby and I remember saying '40k has stagnated' I still think that this holds true. I fear for what they will do with 40k end times (if they come) but I kinda welcome it.

    AoS - looks pretty good and I really want to give it a go. Games are shorter, armies are smaller so I can see this as a great beer and crisps game with some cool stories.
    40k - needs new blood either from new races or by moving the story on.

  8. I agree with all your thoughts and hope they all pan out, will be great for the hobby! I really do believe the plastic thunderhawk is happening, can't see why forgeworld would have 2 pretty similar large flyers in there catalog! Doesn't make sense from a production point of view.

    1. Yup. Deredeo and Contemptor, Sokar and Thunderhawk.

    2. Am I the only one thinking that the thunderhawk could do with a bit of beefing up? Maybe some heresy specific options like volkite weapons and the like. It would be great if GW did a plastic version and FW did some upgrade kits. Hmmm...I'm already planning a AEtos Dios conversion...

  9. I would love it to see (for both 30k and 40k oc):

    - Squats
    - Chaos Squats (we need some stylish hats! :D)
    - full Ordo Reductor army list (FW already started that with the upcoming red book)
    - full Legio Cybernetica list (incorperating both GW and FW stuff)
    - full Skitarii list for 30k
    - Cult Mechanicus units (electro priests are mentioned in the FW fluff, kataphrons are battle servitors) for 30k
    - Hrud aka Space Skaven with Verminlords
    - Exodite Eldar
    - a fleshed out Chaos Cult / Daemonworld armylist, like in 2nd edition
    - plastic MARS pattern warhound
    - plastic Thunderhawk


  10. Hats like these guys?
    Yes, yes, oh, yes.

    1. yeah :D exactly that <3

    2. There are so many cool Xenos ideas! The Tarrellians are a favourite.
      Meg arachnids
      Etc etc! License to print money lol

  11. Squats and more aliens would be welcome. The sight of marines and squats on a table is something I find rather delectable. As for thing I want, there's only really two; 1) a heavier knight chasis which is possible more likely from forge world I'd say, and 2) a plastic super heavy for my marines, thunderhawk might be the most likely, but I'd take a tank or walker of some sort, what with being 'the range' as it were I'm only surprised they haven't done this already.

    1. tbh, both the Thunderhawk and the Fellblade would be awesome in plastic (although the Fellblade isn't that pricey, and wouldn't be that much cheaper in plastic, so, give me a thunderhawk thanks ...)

  12. I know I stand quite isolated on this but, I think all Charaters should be done in resin. Finecast is much more detailed than plastic and the quality is now perfectly fine. It just wasn't ready. However all tanks and core troops should be plastic!!! The extra detail of resin is'nt needed and nor is the weight, warping and price tags. I understand why the Heresy tanks were done in resin but they should have been a lot quicker to make some plastic versions of the best sellers. If they need to protect forgeworld profits let forge world start making plastics. I don't want to see a plastic version of the current ThunderHawk it's too big. Something a bit more like a fat Storm Eagle version of the old Epic thunderhawk would be far more likely to get onto my shelf. Plastic Warhound yes please!
    As to the way they are running Golden Demon this year, it's a disgrace, they are behaving like a company in full retreat when they despratly need to turn around and put on an event that gets people excited by their new product AOS. I can't believe they have done away with the single Golden Demon event. It's like they want someone else to take over the painting completions as well as the tournaments.