Warhammer Fest 2017 is now done and now we wait for the the Forge World open day in August in the meanwhile we can digest what we've found out from the event. I wish I was there to be honest but I've been kept in the loop about all the news and gossip from the weekend.
Well, where to start... First off, as reported here over the weekend: Rogal Dorn will be the next Primarch! I'm so glad that this is the case, after waiting for 4 years for even a hint that he is in the works, he's going to be arriving on a tabletop near you - probably end of this year with any luck!
The new Sokar pattern Thunderhawk - oh man, that kit looks sexy, I think I'll be saving up for that and Dorn!
The new Telemon Heavy Dreadnought - beastly, might have to get one but we'll see how my hobby budget is looking (or if I just buy it on a whim anyway).
Magnus - saw him coming from a mile off, I like that they've done a diorama base for him and Russ, I think this one has worked better than Fulgrim and Ferrus' one.
Constantine Valdor - I'm looking forward to seeing a cast version of him. Liking the look so far though I may be tempted to redo the head myself to match the artwork in Inferno.
Blood Angels transfers - very pretty! I shouldn't be surprised by this - it is the Blood Angels legion after all!
More new stuff for the Talons of the Emperor - very cool, was nice to see the Sisters transport though I think some other stuff needs some attention, actually starting to feel sorry for the Vlka Fenryka players out there pleading for at least a Grey Slayers kit or something!
The future of Horus Heresy (40k 7.5 or HH 1.0) - I would have loved to hear news about Horus Heresy moving to 8th over the coming months but I can understand the reasons why that isn't happening in the short- to mid-term - namely moving the rule set from 7th to 8th would be a huge undertaking due to the huge fundamental changes made to the core rules. I'm worried that the rules may still be bloated like they are currently (I need to take 4 books with me to play my World Eaters, 5 to play my Imperial Fists - would love to see that change some time soon) but the main bit that worries me is accessibility for new players as they need to learn a new rule set to start with HH from mid-June. It works out alright for us veteran players however as are army lists are still valid and play in the exact same way for now.
This in the software development world is known as "forking" from the main development branch, it's a great idea if you are planning to just do you own thing and have no intention to merge back with the "master" rule set (8th edition) however if you do plan to do so it will be much more difficult to merge any rule changes from the "master" rule set into the Horus Heresy rule set.
What did you guys think of the event. Any high points you think I've missed? What are your thoughts on 40k and Horus Heresy taking different paths in terms of core rules?
Until next time!
Hector Cephas
Very disappointed to hear HH is not going to 8th. I am constantly rolling my Death Guard against my buddies tyranids and tau, but I guess the brakes are on for finishing that army now. On the bright side, thunder hawk is sexy AF, gonna have to save for it
ReplyDeleteYeah, it's a shame that that isn't going to be supported anymore. Hopefully your friends may keep their old books so you could still continue playing with you.
DeleteA homebrew expansion for Xenos races in HH sounds like a really good idea to support the Xenos races from 40k granted Tau and Tyranids weren't really around in the Heresy but no reason to not do them anyway as "generic random races #512 and #983 that the Death Guard encountered that one time..."
I have plenty of 40k to play, I just happen to be the only one of my buddies that picked up HH. It might be a good thing though because I won't be spending money on FW for a bit now.
DeleteI'm in the same boat, though tournament wise. I go down to Erie Pennsylvania to play and they allow 30k in their 40k tournaments. It was 95%+ of me using my 30k world eater army. Hopefully once they get all of the black books done, they will put out rules for ninth edition
DeleteVery happy HH is not going to 8th..it's a dog pile
ReplyDeleteCephas, HH is never moving to 8th edition. HH will have it's own rule book based in 7th..Black books will be produced in 7th..there is no short to mid-term..there is just 7th..or HH 1.0 going forward. The HH is not a mainstream game, it's not for Kids.
DeleteLamest. complaint. ever. " I have to carry a few books, turn a few pages"
4-5 books.. you need two to Three books to play any HH army, the two most recent Red books, and a copy of the rules..preferably in mini book form. it' not hard to do.
Ok, for transparency's sake, to show 4-5 books wasn't done kind of exaggeration; for my World Eaters I need to take:
Delete1) 40k core rules
2) HH Crusade Army book
3) HH Legions book
4) Book 6 for Surlak and the additional rules for World Eaters apothecaries
For my Imperial Fists:
1) 40k core rules
2) HH Crusade Army book
3) HH Legions book
4) Book 6 for Knights Errant rules
5) Stronghold Assault (duh, fortifications)
I'll admit, it's a pretty lame complaint but it is what it is and I stand by that - if I want to rule out parts of my army then I could take less books like you suggested.
Furthermore, 7th vs. 8th; I wouldn't say never on that but it feels like the most likely scenario. My point about "forking" was pretty much that, if you are going to part ways to that degree then it's going to be harder to go back, Forge World have obviously had these discussions months ago and that was the decision that was made. Given the circumstances, if I were involved in the decision making process, I probably would have made the same decision too (personal feelings about 8th aside) as given how much 40k has been simplified, transitioning between 7th and 8th would have been a lot of work AND Forge World would have to produce a 40k 7th++ rule set to cover themselves during the transition period! It's a tactical decision pure and simple.
I never said anything about the game being for kids! My concern is that the more complicated rule set is that it will turn away new players as it's more complicated than a lot of the competition out there - it's the exact reason why 40K 8th and AoS are even a thing. A lot of GWs competition are producing games that are easier to play and GW is reacting to that - it may be ok for HH to remain niche and but the entry level for the game has gone up unless you are already familiar with 7th so the pull of HH of "hey, this is 40k but more balanced because you don't have crazy formations in HH" and the like won't be applicable. It's now it's own game which is probably in our best interests as existing players if you are happy with the current rule set whereas a new player transitioning from 8th edition 40k will need to learn a while new game. Hell, if Forge World can streamline 7th rules a bit in the process when tailoring it for HH, that'd be good right?
Hi Mary. Tony C said that HH will be staying in 7th edition for now, he then went on to say it may go to 8th edition later, but not for the foreseeable future.
DeleteWhen I last heard Alan Bligh speak at a seminar he did say that the HH would follow the core GW 40k ruleset, as having too many different rule sets would get convoluted and confusing, so we were expecting HH to go 8th edition.
They may not have had the resource to have achieved it so swiftly without making a lot of red books obsolete, and considering some of them are still quite new, it may have upset the fans.
After all that I want HH 7.1. I want to be able to split fire and game without templates. That was all the fix I thought it needed anyway. For now at least.
My two cents. 7th Edition has worked quite well for me so far, but I only play every now and then against friends (and of course my Eldar friend wins all the time, but who cares?) and many of the supposed stumbling blocks of the ruleset don't happen if two amenable people are face to face. Secondly, the change to 8th reminds me when we went from the super-detailed and character heavy 2nd Edition to a barebones simplified 3rd, where quite a few armies lost their own uniqueness, and have since struggled to catch it up again (Orks, for example). I probably won't be playing any Heresy game myself in the near future, as none of my friends are interested, but I have a few of the books and enjoy immensely reading the background and narrative battles they describe. Cheers.
ReplyDeleteCompletely agree with your first point, playing with nice people helps get over a lot of the problems with the rules, just have had one too many tedious games where the people in question were not even prepared to agree to disagree and just roll off for it and spend 30 minutes trying to find the rules to support their case and just out right killing the fun of the game! Probably still get that in 8th to be fair though :p
DeleteSecond point, I can't really comment from a 2nd to 3rd edition point of view simply because I've not been playing for nearly that long but one of the reasons why FW are going down a different path is because the legions could easily lose their individuality in the process so that's a fair point too. It also makes it difficult to do Great Crusade style games unless you have the old 7th edition codices for the Xenos races like Eldar and Orks.
Hopefully your friends may get interested again and keep hold of their old books so you can play together still.
Custodes Terminators!!!
ReplyDeleteThey look stunning and might have to get some as they look that good and firepikes goes well with salamanders!!
Really enjoyed the event and my highlights were:
ReplyDeleteCustodes Terminators. They look fab and pretty much as I hoped they would look. Hopefully they're very large too, to emphasise the thickness of the armour.
Valdor looks great. I hope they change his face a bit though. He looks very elfy. He needs a broader jaw and less pointy ears imo.
I'm glad 30k is staying with 7th, I think it was the only logical choice in the circumstances.
Glad they're working on Dorn too. He should be fab.
I'm biased but I'm getting less and less patient with the lack of kits for the SW/VF. The 1K sons, sisters, and custodes have all received multiple kits from the inferno book but all the wolves have had is a Dreadnought, it hardly seems a balanced distribution.
ReplyDeleteCompletely agree. It's why, after a 4 year wait, I'm happy Dorn is finally on the horizon (sorry, that was terrible!).
DeleteI'm sure they're in the works - just probably not ready to show yet :)
Hi Andrew. Tony C has described the VF pieces that are almost finished as brilliant. I don't think you will be waiting much longer (August the latest considering that is when the FW open day is).
DeleteBtw Andrew, you forgot Leman Russ and his wolfkin. Speaking as an Imperial Fists player, just be glad you didn't have to wait 4 years for your Primarch 😁 And speaking as a Custodes Player, I'm glad I'm getting all the kits first for once ;)
DeleteBtw Drake, has there been any word, when the new Custodes Dreadnaught will be resleased?